Julia Rock co-hosts this installment of The Access Point, our newly-launched weekly webinar series that aims to prepare Black and brown college students for the workforce by having the real, nuanced talks they don’t know they need. She, Mike Yates and Tristan Layfield take a deep dive into the subject of interviewing effectively.
Read the Episode Below
SPEAKER 1 0:11
Hello, hello. Hello, everyone. Thank you for joining us. Welcome back we are here for what the fourth episode of the access point. So we’re going to go ahead because we have a we have a lot to get through today we’re going to go ahead and dive right into the content. Thank you for joining us I see I see shernika Marvin, Chris, Danielle, yeah, I appreciate you. If everyone who’s on the live can go ahead and let us know. You’re here, where you’re from, introduce yourself, we’d love to interact with you all. So go ahead, drop us a little comment in the chat. But real quick, I just want to open up the show and say, once again, thanks for coming. Access Point is put on by living corporate. And for those of you who don’t know what living corporate is, is a media network that creates content that centers and amplifies black and brown folks in the workplace, or in this case, getting ready to enter the workplace. Because I know we’re talking to a lot of, you know, college students or recent college grads, we got some people from Texas. I see. I see Katy, Texas. I see Charlotte, I see Chicago. Thank you for joining. And so Mike, you want to tell people a little bit about what the point of the access point is, like, what’s the
SPEAKER 2 1:34
Yeah, so the, the way I see the access point, is living corporate has decided to sponsor and promote content and this webinar series that helps you access more and, and greater value and knowledge as you seek to jump into your career. So this is a space for college students, early career professionals, or Heck, even seasoned career professionals to come learn some new skills from industry experts, where our hosts, like Tristan, and I will share our expertise. But we want to bring in experts outside of us so that we can learn and so that you can learn as we all learn together.
SPEAKER 1 2:16
Yes, yes. Yeah, I love it. I love it. So real quick, for those of you who haven’t joined, but for those of you who are aren’t familiar with myself, my name is Crystal lay field. I’m the owner and head career coach of lay field resume consulting. And I actually also do the podcast with living corporate. So you’ve probably heard me on Tristen strips that come out every Thursday. So that’s a little bit about me, I’m based in the Metro Detroit area. And you know, I, I really got into this work, because I noticed that black and brown candidates where I was where, where I was a manager, excuse me, they were having an issue, really conveying their value in their documents and in their interviews, and that that idea just sort of sparked for me that I needed to really help them right. It was like, Hey, I do this for a living. I let me help a community that I know needs help my community, so we can actually start getting the things that we deserve. Right. So that’s sort of what brought me to this work. Mike, tell people a little bit about you.
SPEAKER 2 3:21
Yeah, so I’m an educator and entrepreneur. I work at a crazy school called alpha, where I am doing an espionage mission, so that I can learn to build the most innovative school models possible, and make them free or very, very cheap for black and brown people. Like I’m trying to figure out, you know, Kristen’s from Detroit. I’m trying to figure out how do I go to Detroit, a city that I love, by the way to build schools for children in that city so that they can learn and grow because I feel like the revolution is going to be economic. And that starts with education. I’ve co-founded a couple of apps out there, and I have a podcast of my own called school sucks, which you can check out.
SPEAKER 1 4:08
Perfect, perfect. And today, we have an amazing guest with us. We have Julio Raj, Julia, tell the people about yourself.
SPEAKER 3 4:18
Thank you so much, you guys for having me. I’m so excited to be here. So I’m Julia rock, and I’m a career coach and strategist. And I own rock career development and rock for a development exists to empower black and brown professionals to claim their leadership in the workplace. So while I’m happy to work with folks from all walks of life, my primary focus is black and brown professionals, because for the reasons you mentioned, Tristan, there’s just a disconnect there. And I love the story that you told because that’s really the reason that I started my business. I was going to career fairs and I noticed the disparity between the performances of black candidates specifically, and then other candidates and I knew that I could do something to help level the playing field. And so, so that’s a little bit about what I do. We’ve been in existence now since 2013. And so we just, you know, we’re just here trying to make sure that black people can level up and people of color can level up place.
SPEAKER 2 5:15
So I love that. That’s awesome.
SPEAKER 1 5:18
We wish to get the right people.
SPEAKER 2 5:21
Okay, right, exactly.
SPEAKER 3 5:26
Perfect. Perfect. So I believe it’s time for us, we’re going to move into a couple of questions. So real quick, we have some questions that we’re going to be asking Julia, we’re going to start with some of those. But what we want you to do is there is an ask question feature, you might see it right next to the chat, we want you to go in there. And we want you to ask your questions, so we can pull them up. And we know which ones we are answering at that point in time. Okay. But while you guys are doing that, while you guys are thinking about your questions, on interviewing, effectively, because that’s what we’re going to be talking about today. Put them in the comments, or put them in the ask question section. And we’re going to get to some of those. So the first thing Julio, let’s just talk a little bit, right, all right. So, you know, now, these college students, these early grads, they’ve landed this interview, right? Right? How do you recommend that they start sort of preparing for this? What do they do what step one through five for them?
SPEAKER 1 6:27
Okay, so the very first thing that I recommend you do is kind of take a step back and think about the job that you got an interview for, and try to make sure that you understand what that job is, because you’re going to have to make sure you can show what your skills are in comparison to the job. So make sure that you fully understand what the job is. The next thing is to do the research on the company, to make sure that you understand and you’re not just looking at the first kind of About Us page, you know, really doing the research to understand what the company does, what they offer all of those things. And then make sure that you understand who you are and what you bring to bring to the table, knowing your resume so that you’re not like if they asked you a question. And then if they asked me about you know what your strengths or weaknesses are, you’re not trying to figure it out or looking up at the ceiling, because you’ve taken the time to know yourself. So those are kind of the key things I would say start out doing, understanding the job knowing yourself and then learning about the company, so that you can start preparing and getting your mind ready for the questions you’ll be asked.
SPEAKER 2 7:38
Yeah, yeah. Okay. I think I think that’s great.
SPEAKER 3 7:42
Yeah, I love that. I love that. I love it. Um, I see Zach asked a similar question in the chat, which is, which are what are the things I should be doing before I land the interview?
SPEAKER 2 7:54
Okay. And that’s the thing so when you’re submitting your, your resume and all of that, that’s when you’re supposed to start trying to whether it’s build your network, or trying to build relationships with individuals at the company, before you even get the interview. And making sure that people see you, they get to know who you are, so that hopefully the interview is even more of a conversation versus kind of a cold introduction. So that’s really trying to get your street cred in with the company and still doing your research then.
SPEAKER 3 8:24
Right, right. Yeah, I love that one. I, you know, I was I was telling my brother the other day, the best way to know if you want to work in a company, cuz I told him like, Look, trust an interview is two ways. It’s them interviewing you, and you interviewing them. And so build that relationship. So you know, before you show up, do I want to work with these people.
SPEAKER 1 8:44
And I love that. I love the point of like, reaching out to people at the company, right, starting to develop those relationships, because one thing we know, is, during interviews, I can tell you one thing, but you know, employees might tell you a little bit different about the company. Until you get better inside, I think of how it actually works. Outside of sort of this formal setup of you know, everybody’s going to try and market their company. That’s just what their job is. Right. But then also, you’re starting to build those connections. And maybe next thing you know, that lands in like a referral, that you know, and you’re jumping ahead of the line to actually get an interview, rather than, you know, sitting and going into a black hole. Yep.
SPEAKER 3 9:28
And the other thing is that when you when you do that networking, and you learn a little bit more about the company, you can ask better questions in the interview versus the what’s a typical day, like, what’s the culture like you can ask better questions, because you got the inside scoop.
SPEAKER 2 9:43
Yeah, so I want to ask another question. I see like the chat is heating up, which I love. The questions are coming in. We have some prepared questions and I think these sort of things all together. So, the next question is from Peyton. And she says, if you’ve networked with a few people, should you mention that connection in the interview?
SPEAKER 3 10:12
I think, especially if it can help you. Absolutely. You know, because you can as if you’re introducing herself or you’re having a conversation, you can say, oh, well, you know, I was able to meet with, you know, Kristin, and he and I had a chance to talk about the organization before I got here. So I’m even more excited to speak with you and to interview. So it helps them to know that Okay, so she’s not green. And she has some connections. And she’s even more excited about wanting to work here. She’s shown some real interest.
SPEAKER 1 10:45
Put into work.
SPEAKER 3 10:50
Come on Man. I love it.
SPEAKER 1 10:53
Yeah, okay, perfect. Oh, someone’s at some. So nisha asked a question that I think sort of ties into us talking about reaching out to people, right. She said, what are your thoughts about informational interviews?
SPEAKER 3 11:09
I love informational interviews simply because it takes the pressure off of, okay, you know, you’re going through the, you know, what are your strengths and weaknesses, and so forth. But that’s an opportunity for you to build an organic relationship with someone, but also kind of low key showcase the knowledge that you have. So as you’re having this informational interview with them, you can say, Oh, this is something I read, and I followed up on, what are your thoughts on that had to be a back and forth conversation? So that person that you’re learning from realizes, hey, you know, Juliet really does have interest. And she seems to know a little bit about it. And, you know, I know that she talked me a little bit about what she’s studying in school, maybe there may be an opportunity here for her. So it’s an easy way to get your foot in the door without the pressure of the formal interview setting. So I love informational interviews, wrap them up.
SPEAKER 1 11:58
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I agree with that. 100%. And the one thing I think we want to make sure that people understand too is don’t go into an information interview, informational interview, thinking, you’re going to get a job like that, you got to be very clear, like do not go in expecting something from the other person other than having a conversation and getting information, if anything else results from that great, right. But you want to go in and basically what it does is it allows you to build up ammo, like Julian said, Now you know how to better tailor your resume, you know how to better tailor that cover letter, you know, how to better tailor your questions inside of the interview, or even your answers inside of the interview, what examples that you’re going to use. So I think that it’s really key, I think the information I interview gives you so much info that you’re able to then utilize.
SPEAKER 3 12:48
Yeah, right. Yeah. And the person can also then after you have an informational interview, can then kind of vouch for you in whatever formal interview you have, like, Oh, I already spoke to Tristan, and man, this person is just a bright light, like, you’re going to have a good time talking to them. And that person walks into the interview with you with that positive mind-set about you. Right? Yeah.
SPEAKER 2 13:08
And that travels throughout a company, it travels fast. Like I like the good word about you. Travels, I say a good word about your travels through a company faster than it does on Twitter. Right? Because people are seeing each other’s in the hallways, they’re on zoom calls with everybody now. So now if you have a great informational interview, with somebody who is maybe mid-level management, they may mention you on a call with somebody who’s upper management, or if the company is small enough CEO. And now your name is literally top of mind. So I think it’s really important. And the other thing, the other thing I want to say about informational interviews, and about interviewing in general is do not think that you should interview in isolation, you should be like, let’s say you’re really interested in working at Google, you should try to figure out what projects you can start working on that are very similar to that role. So that when you go into that informational interview, and they say something that reminds you that project, if you naturally bring that up, that that’s going to be a whole different sort of relationship building. Right. So informational interviews, I think. I mean, that’s basically all LinkedIn is now.
SPEAKER 1 14:15
Exactly. It’s so funny. You talked about you talked about coming. Coming top of mine had actually happened with my best friend recently. He had been doing some networking with a couple of people in different areas, and he’s actually an education. And so what ended up happening is there was this project that that’s going to be happening with the state, they got a call together, and three people ended up mentioning his name and the person who was over the project was like, Okay, I need to know who this person is. We have to I have to meet with this person, right? Like it will literally happen for you very quickly. Yeah, yes. 100%. Okay.
SPEAKER 2 14:56
Just a quick side note on that because you mentioned education, if any of y’all are interested in You want to make a lot of money, I’m telling you from the educator on this, but that is how you make a lot of money in education. If you figure out how to leverage your social media and leverage, like meeting with people off those platforms, to talk to them about your ideas that maybe your principal won’t hear, or maybe that you’re not in a place to push yet, like becoming top of mind for education is honestly today. It is very, very important because you can find yourself in some rooms that you would never imagine. And it’s all through that relationship building and connected like that, that if you want to work in education that is how you make a lot of money.
SPEAKER 2 15:35
SPEAKER 1 15:37
SPEAKER 1 15:39
I think we have quite a few questions in the question answer section.
SPEAKER 2 15:43
This is the hot the hottest Q&A I think we’ve had yet. So yeah, Danielle has a question. It says as a person who’s about to graduate soon, what questions would be the wrong questions during the interview? And, Julie, I want to I want to sort of make this a double barrel questions. What would be the wrong questions for you the interview? Like whose being interviewed to ask, but also, what would be the wrong questions for the employer to ask?
SPEAKER 3 16:12
Okay, okay, so we’ll start with the wrong with the wrong questions at the interviewee. So the person being interviewed can ask, asking me question. So walking into the interview asking about, well, you know, when do I get paid, what’s the salary, what’s the benefit, structure, all that kind of stuff, you’re going into the interview trying to show what value you offer. And so if you’re walking in looking for what you can get, it already rubs the person the wrong way. Also, if you’re trying to look like trying to change your schedule, like, well, how quickly can I change my schedule? Or can I have a flexible work schedule, all that in the interview, again, you’re going to try to provide value. So if you’re already looking to see what you can get out of it, that’s where you’re going to have some problems. So I would highly recommend staying away from the questions. That’s really where you’re going to find yourself in problems on the employer side, where they can’t ask questions. It’s truly about things that are personal. So things that would be a basis for discrimination. They’re not supposed to ask you about your age, your sexual orientation, your marital status, whether or not you have kids, your ethnic background, where you’re from, and in some states, you know, if you’ve had a job before, they’re not allowed to ask you about your salary history either. So there are plenty of questions. So like I said, when it comes to your personal life and personal business that they that they are not allowed to ask you because it can be the basis of discrimination.
SPEAKER 1 17:39
Nice. I think all those were good. I do have a follow up question for that, though. So, Julia, we’ve talked about what are the wrong questions for someone to ask, it’s not about what are the wrong questions for an interviewer to ask you? What are some questions that that you should be asking, when you go into an interview? Why should you be asking your employer?
SPEAKER 3 18:02
Awesome, like, I love this question, because one of the biggest, biggest mistakes people make like the most common interview mistake is that they walk into an interview or they get to the end. And the interviewer says, well, hey, do you have any questions for me? And I’m like, No, I’m okay. And it’s like, no, no. And so some of the questions that I that I highly recommend asking are first about the job itself, to show your interest. So beyond like, what, what’s a typical day, like, you know, ask questions about, well, what are the immediate expectations for the role? Or what are the milestones that should be delivered in, say, the first 30 or 60 days, so that you can see that you’re thinking ahead, you know, what are the top three or five qualities that someone in this role should have in order to be successful, so thinking about the job and how you can be successful there. But then also ask questions about the company, so that you can show some additional interest. So that’s why the research is so important. So you can ask questions about the current events that you see. You can also ask the interviewer about, well, where do you see the company going in the next three to five years, and trying to make sure that that, that they can see that you’re not looking to just jump ship, as soon as you get in that you care about the long term health and success of the company? And then ask questions of the interviewer. You know, what I think helps to build rapport is showing an interest in that person. So saying, well, how you know, you know, what do you think about or talk a little bit about your career? Or why have you stayed with this company for so long? What do you like most? Or what do you know, what excites you most about the future of the company? So getting that person’s particular perspective could then help you to establish the rapport with them as well?
SPEAKER 2 19:43
I love the question. Like the question that you brought up, where do you see the company going in three to five years? That question is sneaky smart, because it’s also a way to determine whether or not you should run away from that company. Because if they like No, Julie, I don’t know where it’s going. You like, oh, okay, well, no. And I had a friend that, um, that ended up working. And we were right as we work was going nuts, like, as Adam Newman was losing his mind. But he, he took that calculated risk, because he asked at the interview, like, Where are y’all going in next year five in that, and his friend that was interviewing him said, Look, with this CEO, we could go literally anywhere. So just be ready. But he had the expectation. So when that honestly historical debacle happened, he was ready for it. So that’s a very smart question. Write that one down people.
SPEAKER 1 20:43
And Julie, there’s a question I’ve been hearing floating around the internet. And I’ve heard some career coaches say this, I want to get your take on it. People will say that you ask how did this position become vacant. Is that a question that you suggest people ask?
SPEAKER 3 20:58
I really do like that question as well, because it gives you some context about you know, what happened to the role? Did someone leave? Did someone get promoted? And then you can always ask, Well, how long has the role that open? Because then you can figure out okay, have they interviewed other people that nobody won’t this job? Or is it or is it fresh? So I highly recommend getting some kind of background info on the job. There’s nothing wrong with that getting some context for sure.
SPEAKER 1 21:29
Yes, yes. Perfect. I love that. I just always, I always like to get other people’s take on that question. I know something I feel comfortable asking that. At least when I’ve talked to a couple of clients and coach them around it, they felt uncomfortable asking that question. I was like, look, they’re going to ask you, whatever question is hard questions that they have for you. You might as well go. Okay.
SPEAKER 2 21:53
Turnover is real?
SPEAKER 1 21:54
It’s a two way street.
SPEAKER 2 21:56
Right? You do not want to be in a revolving door, a company. That’s a revolving door turnover. Yeah, so let’s, let’s show some love to the Q&A section. So Nisha asked a question, which is how do you leverage negative feedback
SPEAKER 3 22:15
From an interview, so you’re getting feedback from the interviewer? And in terms of negative feedback?
SPEAKER 2 22:20
I think I think she just asked how you leverage negative feedback. So she Nisha, feel free to clarify in the comments, but what I’m thinking is like, maybe leverage it to do well on an interview or, or if you’re, if your interviewer gives you negative feedback,
SPEAKER 3 22:37
Right, and then use it for another interview. That’s, that’s what I want to clarify.
SPEAKER 1 22:42
SPEAKER 3 22:44
Okay. And so I think that that, you know, you don’t think of it as negative you think of it as constructive feedback, because if they give you something actionable, you know, then you can say, Okay, this is how I can prep because let’s say you went in and you didn’t ask any questions, or you didn’t come across as clear in your answers. Now you know what to go ahead and practice. Now you know what to go ahead and research so that when you have the next interview that you’re prepared to, I would say, any interview that you get negative feedback or constructive feedback from Think of it as a test run. It’s, you know, so you know, hey, it didn’t work out with this job. But it preps you for the next opportunity.
SPEAKER 1 23:20
Yeah, I love that. And honestly, count yourself lucky because most people do not provide feedback. So when it comes to interviews, actually, I’m actually doing a session on this at the virtual HR summit this upcoming Thursday about recruiters ghosting people after interviews, because that’s typically what happens. So if you get some if you get some feedback, conscious of lucky, because like Julia said, is constructive feedback and go work on the things that they pointed out, because most companies won’t even take the time to do that. Usually out of fear of lawsuits for the wrong things being said. But I think that was a really great question to Nisha. Because if you get it sometimes it gets a lot of things in the job search process hurts people’s ego, right with in. So one thing, we have to realize that a lot of this is not personal, it’s business. And we just got to take it as such and figure out how we can adjust and maneuver. So if you get that feedback, just take it in stride and move forward and see how you can progress.
SPEAKER 3 24:26
And the other thing is that what’s for you is for you. So if this if this one didn’t work out, and you got negative feedback, you know, and you know, that’s a positive that you actually got something to work on. And the right thing for you is going to come along and now you have the right feedback to help you prepare so that you can capture that next opportunity.
SPEAKER 2 24:43
Mm hmm. That’s great. Yep. Yeah. What’s for you is for you that’s great.
SPEAKER 1 24:47
What’s for you is for you. Absolutely. Sometimes it’s just a matter this company isn’t the right mix for you. It’s just what it is and they don’t like how you show up. They don’t like the answers you gave cool. Hey, somewhere else is probably going to think you’re a rock star. So
SPEAKER 2 25:01
That’s true. Yeah, yeah, my sister right or wrong my sister every time she interviews for a position she doesn’t get. So she’ll tell herself I’m too big for that company. That’s what she has to do to move on you know, you got to do now.
SPEAKER 1 25:20
So, back to these Q&A questions. So somebody, Angelina provided a question in relation to informational interview. So once you do, she says, once you do have that, is it appropriate to ask the person you are having the informational interview with to pass your resume to the hiring manager.
SPEAKER 3 25:41
I’m so I’m interested to hear your take on this Tristen but for me, personally, I think that if it’s an informational interview, that’s what it should be. It’s a networking opportunity, it’s for you to gain information and to start building the relationship. If you then try to slide your resume at the end, it seems like an almost kind of a bait and switch or Cloak and Dagger type of routine. And it goes from informational interview for I’m just trying to get my foot in the door. And while that is what you’re trying to do, you don’t want to have a bright neon sign saying I’m trying to get my foot in the door. So I would say you know, because if that’s a good relationship, they may say, Well, they can ask you Oh, hey, do you have a resume if they open the door great. And or they can say let’s have a follow up conversation. But you don’t want to make it seem as if you’re trying to get something out of the conversation, it’s meant to just be a networking conversation for you.
SPEAKER 1 26:33
And see, you said you want my opinion, you don’t need it, you just gave it. Like, that’s, for me goes back to what I said earlier, the do not expect something from this informational interview other than information, the you always follow the lead of the person that you were doing this interview with, if they asked for the interview, if they asked for the resume, provide the resume, if they don’t ask for it, move on and just follow up thanking them for their time, you never know what they may ask at that point, right. But you never want to make them feel like they’re being used, you don’t like to fill us, none of us like to fill us. So never do that whatsoever. You know, like you said, don’t do the bait and switch. That’s just
SPEAKER 2 27:21
Innovation. Informational interviews are the long game, that they’re playing the long game in the career process, because then that interview may not pay off today or next week or next month. But in six months or a year, you may end up with a job that you never imagined yourself having, because of that one conversation. And so it’s important to stay engaged with that person online. Right. So use the internet to your advantage. Or if you see that person out and about in your daily life, I mean, none of us go anywhere anymore. But like, like, like if that person is posting content online, engage with their constant content and give them your thoughts give away your intellectual property to that person in their direction. So that when it comes time to mention somebody’s name, who should be top of mind for whatever it may be you
SPEAKER 3 28:15
Can I give you a real example of that with living corporate, I think I’ve been following Tristan now for at least a year, I live in corporate for at least a year? And so nothing has happened because it’s just been purely organic. And now we found a synergy, you know, a whole year later. And I’m trying to look for anything, it was just that, hey, I really like their content, and I want to continue to engage with them. And, you know, start from the bottom. Now we’re here. You know what I mean?
SPEAKER 1 28:40
Right? Yeah, no, I mean, building relationships with people, right? Yeah, you just want to build the relationship. And at some point, there’s going to be an opportunity that could be a week into the building the relationship, it could be, like Julie said, a year into building that relationship, right? At that point, no one feels us. It’s something that that grew organically.
SPEAKER 2 29:00
And like I said, like, like I’ve said this before here, but like I haven’t, I haven’t used my resume to get a job in over six years. But it’s because I like I’m bad at writing resumes. And so like I’ve told you before, when Tristan comes up there with those career tips and resume tips, I listened to him, because I’m bad at it. But I’m really, really good at getting on zoom and getting on a phone call with people and making they remember who I am. So for me, I use the informational interview to circumvent the part of the job search process that I ate, and then I’m bad at. Right. So I think it’s really important that…
SPEAKER 1 29:40
I see so many people do that exact same thing. And that’s one of the things I sort of coach people through that job search process. Like look, applying online is not a job search strategy. Building relationships is a job search strategy and if you do it before you need it, it will always help you when the time comes, so you just need to be on top of it.
SPEAKER 2 30:03
That’s right. Yeah, yeah. Well, let’s, let’s hop back to the Q&A. It’s hot over here this Q&A is. So Marvin says, what students should do in their final year of college to be appealing to recruiters.
SPEAKER 3 30:19
So if you can do well, it depends on kind of what program you’re in. But I would say a couple of things. One, if you have an opportunity to do an internship or a co-op, something that’s related to your field, so that you can have something to put on your resume. also thinking about the coursework that you’re in, if there is a capstone project, or something that you can be involved in, that’s directly related to your field or some sort of pitch competition or Case Competition, anything that can then tie directly to that field. So it’s really about doing the work ahead of time. And then obviously, you want to have the good grades and so forth, so that you can graduate with the right GPA. That’s important. But it’s also about laying that groundwork of work experience. So it’s not just Hey, I have theoretical knowledge. I’ve got practical applied knowledge, either through work or through projects, something that could go on.
SPEAKER 2 31:10
Yeah, now let me let me ask a follow up question that Julia cuz a lot of people got came you they commented on that question. They said, beef up your LinkedIn profile. Right. And, and people know, on here, I love LinkedIn. And I’m going to tell you, I’m going to give you all some insider knowledge. LinkedIn is about to become a real friendly place for black and brown creators. We are meeting with them tomorrow to talk about how to amp how to truly amplify black voices. I love it just have it as a hashtag. So but what do you think the role of LinkedIn is in the job search process in the interviewing process?
SPEAKER 3 31:45
So LinkedIn is really where people are going to source candidates now, because if you think about, especially as things are going more virtual, people aren’t necessarily trying to go through email and all that trying to find, they can go and look at your online profile. So that’s really your online resume as it were. And so if you don’t have a LinkedIn profile, if it’s just a skeleton, you’re almost not even in the game right now. So next you’re doing whether you’re getting certifications, or awards or your degrees or associations. All of that needs to be on your LinkedIn profile, so that when people are coming to look for you, they can see a holistic picture of your career, your education, and they don’t have to try to fish through an application to get that.
SPEAKER 1 32:26
Yeah, absolutely. And I think the key here, one of the things that I tell people is you can have a great profile, and you should have a great profile. But LinkedIn is all about engagement, both creating your own content and engaging with other people’s content. And I’m not talking about, hey, you know, this is a great post, I’m talking about adding your opinion, adding your thoughts, continuing the conversation. Those are the things that LinkedIn likes to see. And they help prioritize. So we want to make sure that we’re engaging not just with our own posts, but with other people’s posts. And the one that, like you said, Julie, earlier about positioning yourself, you know, in their last year before college is that internship stuff. So with a lot of people internships are great. One of the things that happens, those a lot of people can’t land them, or there’s issues right now. Right? So one of the things that I I’ve seen, I don’t know how you sort of tell people to deal with that, Julio. But for me, it’s Get creative, right? You’re in marketing. Okay. Well, there’s hundreds of 1000s of entrepreneurs out here who need some help with marketing right now. Yep, reach out to one of them. Right, you can gain practical experience without actually being at a big box company as well, that guy provides opportunity and provides real world application of skillsets too.
SPEAKER 3 33:45
Absolutely I tell I tell my clients, when I do workshops, there’s only a certain amount of information that is the business of the employer. And if you do a side hustle, or freelance or volunteer work for marketing or something in your field, and you don’t get paid, that’s none of their business, it still counts as experience, you can look it on your resume, you can list it on LinkedIn, you can highlight it and say that you have this experience, because technically you have the experience whether or not you got compensation has nothing to do about whether or not you gain the skills. Yeah, that you know, that they need. And to your point, trust and engaging on LinkedIn is so important. And they have all these different groups, whether it’s your alumni groups, or you know, geographic location, you can start to engage their network organically, because these are people who are either like-minded or in the same geographic region. So you don’t even have to just always focus on the big broader LinkedIn population started with those groups and start some of those discussions.
SPEAKER 2 34:40
Yeah, yeah. I’ll tell you, you know, what, one of the things I feel really strongly about is, is engagement on LinkedIn. I, I don’t think people understand, you know, like how powerful LinkedIn is. And so I’m going to explain this really shortly if I can, but like, LinkedIn right now offers what you call organic reach, right so for a business that’s under-priced marketing, right. It’s basically very cheap or free marketing. So if you think of yourself as a brand or a business, and let’s say you do start working for free, like I tell people, I took college students and high school students all the time, Oh, you want to get your marketing, Oh, you want to get into the music business, you should dm everybody you can think of in the music business and say, I will work for free for you for three months, if you at the end of those three months, recommend me to x company or x person, or if you decide to hire me at the end of those three months. Great, right. So when you’re doing that, that sort of hustle, whether it’s a paid internship, whether it’s just volunteer work, whatever, you should be documenting that on LinkedIn, people say, I don’t know what to post, that’s what you post, you post what you’re doing what you’re learning the work products that you’re creating, you’re literally building a track record a public track record of what you’ve learned and what you’ve done. So that when it comes time for somebody to get on LinkedIn and say, Hey, I need this kind of person, because they literally typed that in because LinkedIn offers organic reach, LinkedIn is going to fill their feed with people who are doing that thing. So let’s say it’s graphic design, and you’re posting your designs, if somebody posts that the next week or two they’re going to be seeing, the more you use that platform, the better. I tell I said this, in our first episode, you should be posting three times a day.
SPEAKER 3 36:24
And stepping in there really quickly, when it comes to LinkedIn. So to your point, we were saying that, hey, you’re trying to work with specific individuals, what you can do kind of backdoor your way before you just go on with cold messaging, try to engage with content posting, just you know, and share your thoughts, try to get a conversation going so that when you send that connection request with an inmail, that it’s not, you know, cold, like who is this person they already have, it’s more of a warm connection versus a cold one. And then just the other comment on content on LinkedIn. LinkedIn really likes native content. So develop your content on LinkedIn, if you can post articles, post videos that are native to LinkedIn instead of linking off to other platforms, because they don’t have as much visibility or reach. So just another comment.
SPEAKER 1 37:12
They like to keep people there, that’s sure. It goes off the platform, you can literally post the same exact post one with a link that takes somebody away from LinkedIn, and no with the link in the comments that does it. And the one with the one in the comments is going to get way more engagement than the one that’s in the post simply because they don’t recognize it as removing or taking someone away from the platform. But you will you drop so many gems, the other things you talked about with LinkedIn groups, and I think underrated. LinkedIn groups are underrated. Yes, there are some that are defunct, let’s just be real. Right? LinkedIn groups are underrated in building relationships. Then one of the other things that, that this is a tactic that I utilize sometimes when we’re trying to reach out to people, and one of the first things you want to do is make a connection with them in a sense of like, okay, we went to the same school, we worked at the same companies, we have the same interests, right? Well, the same interest can happen from being in certain LinkedIn groups, and then allows us to message people directly from the group. And it says, Tristan lay field, from Detroit, young professionals, understanding of how you all are linked and are more likely to respond to you. Right. So they’re dropping all the keys and Joe’s about LinkedIn tonight. Okay, so LinkedIn is the place to be right now. You need to be building that up. And you need to be engaging that I think that’s just simply what it all boils down to. Right. So let’s, let’s go back and find the people to love and these questions. So joy asked, oh, hey, Joe, I think I think we talked recently, hey, what are your thoughts about asking the interviewer slash hiring managers about their negative Glassdoor reviews?
SPEAKER 3 38:59
Um, so, I think you want I think, is about how you want to frame the question, because the, what I would be asking is, or the question I would ask joy is, what are you trying to get out of that answer from them? Because depending on to the person even read the negative reviews, do they know? And what are you trying to gain? And that’s how you help to frame the question because it can come across as a got you almost when you’re trying to ask a question like, Oh, well, I saw that they said it to fire and everybody what you think about, you know, it comes across as a got you. So I would say before you ask the question, what are you really trying to get out of that? And would the question be better served by actually asking people who work there versus in the interview setting because he’s going to come from people who are employees, the person who’s in the in the chair across from you is always going to give you the party line, the super packaged corporate speak. So if you’re really trying to get the tea, I mean, I don’t know if it’s worthwhile to get it because you’re not you may not get a genuine answer and then it comes across as adoption. But I don’t know how you think about that.
SPEAKER 1 40:03
Yeah, no, I agree. And it’s all about thinking about how you how you want to frame this, like you said, so, you know, if everybody’s saying, oh, they fire everybody, they fire everybody. Well then go back to the question that we asked previously, how did this role become vacant? Right? Now that gives you a little bit more information without it coming off as a got you moment. Right. So it’s figuring out how to take that information and form good questions from them that that aren’t in any way offensive, I guess, in that in that sense, right. So I love everything that you said around that one, because it definitely can come out come off as a got you, right. It’s sort of it sort of reminds me of somebody at like, well, we called your previous boss, and your previous boss said this about you? What do you have to say? Right? You wouldn’t want them to do that to you. So you know, you really want to make sure that the way you’re framing things, the way you’re bringing it up is in a way that is still respectful, but getting you the information that you need.
SPEAKER 2 41:00
Absolutely. Yeah. And isn’t, isn’t there a separate site other than Glassdoor? Where people are starting to review recruiters? Isn’t there a separate site?
SPEAKER 1 41:10
SPEAKER 2 41:12
I think I’ll find the name of it. But there but if you really want like, if you see a negative review on Glassdoor, and you really want, like you really, really want to be there is this website where? Where it’s like a, it’s like its own website? It’s not like through indeed, or LinkedIn or anything like that. It’s its own website, where they reveal recruiters. Yeah, but the thing I would say about negative reviews online, is if you just think about the type of person that sends that, that writes a negative review, normally, it’s somebody where something really bad happened. And it right, you don’t know whose fault it is, right? Like, what’s the person’s motivation for going online and writing that bad review? Like, I don’t do that very often. So like, you know, I’m normally not that hurt.
SPEAKER 3 41:58
I mean, you think about it, you know, bad news travels faster than good news. When you have a good experience with a company or a product. You’re not just running and saying, hey, let me tell everybody this thing. It’s like, Hey, I’m just happy with the good thing. But if something bad happened, you all over Twitter, you want everything talking about how bad it is, you know what I mean? So you have to take that with a grain of salt, too.
SPEAKER 1 42:19
Yeah. And they always say it the old saying this is this is like old saying, Yeah, man, man’s trash is another man’s treasure. So yeah, because it was terrible for somebody else does not mean it’s going to be terrible for you. That’s, that’s for you to ask the questions to figure out and to find out.
SPEAKER 3 42:35
SPEAKER 2 42:37
Yeah, so we got another Q&A question. With lots of Q&A questions. This is the most I think we’ve had,
SPEAKER 1 42:47
Like, you’re like, we’re like, screw our question.
SPEAKER 2 42:53
Exactly. So this one says, this is from Whitney. So thank you for the question. Whitney, it says how much time is recommended to spend preparing for an interview?
SPEAKER 3 43:03
Um, so I think you should be preparing for an interview before you even get one. So I don’t really have a time frame. Obviously, the night before trying to crash the night before. It’s not the answer. But you know, but if you’re trying to look for a stake in the ground, say at least a couple of days that you have enough time to fully research the company, fully understand the job, you know what it’s that you can talk to some of the individuals that work at the company. So you want to think about how much time do I need to do all of those things and be armed with the information I need to go into the conversation. So that’s why I say prepare before they even they book you for the interview, but at least a few days, so that you have enough time to do all this prep work? Because you can’t do it in 24 hours, that’s for sure.
SPEAKER 1 43:49
Yeah. Oh, look, I tell people, this is what I say. This, your job search starts day one of your new job. Okay, so technically, you’re preparing from that moment for your interview. That means looking at companies, you want types of positions that you want the certifications and trainings, you need the type of, Okay, I got this job, but I’m noticing these things aren’t right for me. Okay, great. Now I have questions to ask about company to see if this is a better fit for me. Every job search process starts day one of your new job and if it doesn’t, then you’re behind the eight ball.
SPEAKER 3 44:24
SPEAKER 2 44:26
You’ll get stuck. Like that not having that mind-set. Trust me, these employers are not they’re not loyal to you. And so loyalty, like fairness, as the fair is the place where they judge pigs, it doesn’t exist, right? Like that’s another old statement. We like, you know, say like, I love that Tristan.
SPEAKER 3 44:49
Idea, like from day one. I mean, because the idea is if you stay ready, you don’t have to get ready and so operate from a mind-set of well, how much time do I have to get ready? If you stay ready and you’re prepping from the moment, you get that new job and you’re kind of keeping your accomplishments to the side, you’re looking up the new jobs and the things that you want. By the time that interview comes, you don’t have to spend all them days prepping because you’re you already have all those things already in the works. Right.
SPEAKER 1 45:18
Now, like, literally, that’s probably the biggest key I can give anybody getting ready to enter the workforce is literally start your job search process day one of your new job. So yeah, but Okay, perfect. Back to the questions back to the questions. So they, we have Angelina says, uh, oh, I think somebody moves the question. Hold on, um, people are up voting questions. I was like, yeah, it’s got moved. It says the market is super competitive right now, even if I’m doing all the right things, I asked him questions addressing your value, what can I do to go above and beyond to seal the deal?
SPEAKER 3 46:00
Hmm. And so I think that it’s a couple of different things. So people hire people that they like. So if you think about building a rapport with your interviewer, so it’s not just about, you know, answering the questions well, or, or asking good questions. But what kind of impression do you make on the interviewer? Even before you get into the question and answer phase, if there’s something you can connect with them about? I’ll give you an example. You know, an interview that I was in, I found out that the interviewer he’s saying, and I used to sing, and I found out he was a baritone, and I was an alto. And that was a moment that we connected on. And that’s something that I think helped to push me over the edge. So can you build some rapport with the interviewer? But then also, it’s about the follow up, there are plenty of people who can answer good questions and ask good questions. But if you have the right follow up, so when the email like if you follow up, say within 24 hours, that’s my recommendation to send a follow up. So you’re still Top of Mind that you’re following up, and you’re quoting good parts from the conversation, trying to make sure that you’re reconnecting with them. And then if you want to go above and beyond, you can always send like a handwritten note, something additional to say, hey, just wanted to, you know, confirm, again, whether you want to send a small token, or if you just want to send the note, but something that shows Hey, I want to stay top of mind something that will set me apart for everyone who just walks out and shake hands. So those are a couple of things that I know that you can do to kind of really just set yourself apart from everyone else in the pool.
SPEAKER 2 47:29
Yeah, can we can we highlight for a second to handwritten note? That is key. In a digital world, especially right now? Yes. Where everything takes longer. If you know, you have an interview on Thursday, then I would put that that letter in the mail on Tuesday, so that by the time you walked out of that office, there’s a good chance that they might have that note sitting on their desk, and they’re like, wow, this person is very, very thoughtful. And so in a digital world going analog in that sense, can put you ahead.
SPEAKER 3 47:58
SPEAKER 1 47:59
Yeah, yeah, I agree with everything there. Now there’s one thing that I’ve worked with clients on and they’re their thing I didn’t create this is actually saw the Career Coach, you pass this on LinkedIn. But there’s a thing called a value validation project, where essentially, you actually do a project to sort of showcase that you have the skills that you’re saying, and, and putting it in front of the right people. Right. So I’ll give you two quick examples here. So you know, maybe you and this is something I actually worked with someone who’s a client, they were a user interface and user experience person, they were trying to get into that space. Well, there was an app that they liked, but they hated the interface. So what they did is they went in actually mocked up the new interface and sort of wrote explanations for why they would change things move things based on research, this, that and the other. And they actually ended up submitting that or giving that to someone during an informational interview. And next thing they know, they were actually coming in for a real interview and got a job with the company. You know, so there’s tons of different things. There’s a story and I’ll put a link in the chat about value validation projects. There was a story on there about someone who, you know, they want to go into marketing at a certain company, and what they decided to do, okay, I know all about Google ads. So they created an entire Google ad campaign targeting the company. So when people at that company went to Google, they were saying check out so and so’s resume in the ad section, right? Like, you got to get creative in these times and figure out how to showcase that you actually have the skills you say you have rain, let me tell
SPEAKER 2 49:40
You that, you know, there’s a dude at Tesla, who did a value validation project and ended up with equity in the company. Wow. Like two patented inventions for Tesla and equity in the company. And the job right like
SPEAKER 1 49:57
We do have to be we have to be mindful of it, though. Right, like in certain spaces, we have to be mindful to that there is a reality that some of these companies may actually just steal your idea, right? They will, oh, you got to be mindful, you got to be able to sort of, you know, assess whether this is something you think you can do for a certain company, but, but I think it’s something that’s worth looking at, especially if you can find a way where they can’t take all of your actual intellectual property,
SPEAKER 3 50:22
Right? Is there a way to kind of skinny it down while you’re still sharing what it what it is, but you’re not giving away the farm and they can just run away with your idea? And they’re not giving you any credit?
SPEAKER 2 50:34
SPEAKER 1 50:37
Yeah. All right. Let’s jump back into another question. This one’s interesting. This one, this one’s from Peyton. It says I have an interview Monday with current associates in the role I’m applying for how should I approach this differently than with a hiring manager?
SPEAKER 3 50:52
So is this isn’t like a panel interview that you have with the current associates? I just want to get some more context.
SPEAKER 2 51:00
Let us know Peyton in the in the chat.
SPEAKER 1 51:05
A little more context around this but I’m also congrats to you having an interview on Monday.
SPEAKER 1 51:15
It’s with two current a.
SPEAKER 3 51:18
Okay, okay, so two current associates. And I think one mistake you don’t want to make is that you become more lacs with the associates them with the hiring manager, you think that because these are folks that always work there, or that they’re maybe they’re closer to your level versus where the hiring manager might be that you that you can kind of get too familiar, or what have you. However, though, I think you can ask different questions, because a hiring manager is going to have a kind of a higher level perspective on how the organization is run, and all those kinds of things. But an associate who’s doing the grunt work, you can really ask more pointed questions about what working there is like, you know, what, what are the expectations? You know, what skills have been valuable for them? You can really get into the nuts and the nitty gritty here when it comes to questions, because these are people that are maybe recent hires, and can talk through their experiences about what has worked, what hasn’t, what has been valuable for them, what’s not, what does the company pay attention to when hiring versus not. So you can get kind of straight from the horse’s mouth at that point, versus a hiring manager who has more of a strategic or higher level perspective. So you know, those two associates may truly be a goldmine. But I would, I would say, I would just caution you against, you know, getting too familiar being too comfortable, because you think they may be at a different level. Once you walk into the door, and an organization or in an online setting, you’re in an interview, anyone who’s seeing you is in some way interviewing you or measuring you up in some way. So you always want to stay on point and stay on your guard.
SPEAKER 2 52:57
I love that I tell people from the moment you leave your house, you’re at the interview. Because you never know who you are. That person you flick off in traffic might be the person you’re interviewing with. So be very mindful of that. Okay. But yeah, no, and I think those are all really great things. You know, Peyton, you could even ask things about, you know, like, what are some current issues that teams are running the team is running into right now. Right? Boom, now you have an understanding of some of their issues. So when you meet with that hiring manager, I can show you how I’m the resolution to whatever problem that you’re having. Right? So I bet Julia saying their wealth of knowledge 100% they’re underground, they’re doing that work on a regular basis. So you can get a lot more, you know, useful information to tailor things for. Absolutely. Okay, so I think I think we got we got one more we can take one more question. We got about five minutes left. Um, so Julian, I don’t know if you’re able to see the questions or not. Can you go to the ask question section?
SPEAKER 1 54:06
Yes, I can. Okay,
SPEAKER 2 54:07
Okay. I’m going to let you choose your own question because there’s so many good ones in here I you know, I just feel like what do you think we want to answer right now?
SPEAKER 3 54:20
Oh, man. Okay, I’m going to see if I can quickly try to get through to the first one is what are your thoughts about the open to work label on that one? I hate that I just don’t do it the open to work looking for opportunities just No, no, no, no, in Spanish No, in capital letters, just no. It just it makes me look desperate. And it just, you know, it can come across it doesn’t get the right impression. So I would highly recommend if you don’t have to put it on there for any reason. Don’t put it on there. Let me see if I can get one more in
SPEAKER 1 54:58
They kills your hair.
SPEAKER 3 55:00
Absolutely isn’t it appropriate for recruiters to ask about your job about your current salary? I think joy kind of answered that question. But the fact is, in certain states, it’s illegal for them to ask you about your salary. So you want to make you want to check and make sure what are the rules in your state. And there’s nothing wrong with saying, Hey, I’m negotiable. For the right opportunity. I would love to just learn more about the role before getting into the figures, you can always try to duck and dodge a little bit. You don’t have to always, you know, give away the farm. But I would recommend checking in your state for sure. You see,
SPEAKER 2 55:38
One more, we can do one more.
SPEAKER 1 55:45
One more, okay during an interview, what is the best way to respond to a behavioural question that you may not be confident in answering? Um, so what I would say is it you know, if you’re not confident in answering the question, take, you know, take a step back or ask something to help you clarify and make sure that, okay, maybe you don’t feel confident because you don’t understand the context. Or maybe there’s another setting. And it also just gives you more time to stall and think, when you’re asking that clarifying question. So I would say if you’re not confident, take that extra minute, don’t be afraid of silence, you don’t have to answer right, then you can say, you know, hey, you know, that’s a good question. Give me a second to think about that. Take your time to think then you get an extra couple seconds, if you ask a clarifying question. So you’re stalling a little bit more, and then that should give you some time to come together with an answer. And if you’re still not confident, see if there’s a way that you can pivot that to an experience that you are confident about, and say, Well, I haven’t quite had that same experience. But something that may be similar, that delivers that same type of skill or similar deliverable was x. So maybe you don’t quite answer that question. You pivoted a little bit so that you can still show that you have some skills, and that you can answer the question confidently. Try to get rapid. How did I learn?
SPEAKER 3 57:15
You didn’t try you did that? Well, Julia, we want to thank you so much for coming on. I don’t know about everybody else. But I have really, really enjoyed this. Let us know in the comments. If you’ve enjoyed this, I think you are a wealth of knowledge, my friend. So thank you, thank you for coming and sharing this now. Let the people know where can they connect with you? Where can they follow you tell people about you?
SPEAKER 1 57:37
Absolutely. So you can follow me on my business pages on social media, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, at Rock career. And, you know, if you want to follow my kind of my personal journey, I’m at the Julia rock on Twitter, as well as Instagram. And then my website is rock career.com. So I’m pretty consistent on all platforms. It’s pretty simple. So you guys can follow me. And I’ll also let me give you guys my LinkedIn or do you have my LinkedIn listeners? You can, you can share it in the chat. You guys can connect with me there. I would love to connect with all of you. And if I can be a resource in some place in some way, please don’t hesitate to reach out.
SPEAKER 2 58:17
Yes, perfect. Mike, tell the people where they can follow you.
SPEAKER 3 58:20
Yeah, you. You follow me on LinkedIn. I spend the most time there. Twitter, and tick tock and Instagram at just Mike Yates. And so and that’s basically it, you get my website hates my.com.
SPEAKER 1 58:39
Look, yeah, you had to switch it up on him go backwards. So I just put his LinkedIn in the chat as well. And like I said, my name is Tristan lay field. You can follow me at lay field resume, lay field resume on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook. And if you need to connect with me on LinkedIn, I’ll pop my link into the chat as well. And we want to ask you all to make sure that you follow levering corporate follow them here on crowd cast. Follow them at living corporate on Instagram at living corporate underscore pod on Twitter, and check us out at www dot living dash corporate.com. So thank you. Thank you, everybody, for following this conversation for engaging with us. I’m telling you, y’all have some amazing questions. I need to come back every week. Okay, every week for us. But, Mike, you got anything you want to say to the people?
SPEAKER 2 59:38
No, just thank you guys for coming. I mean, the engagement is amazing. Y’all like, like, be ready to catch this wave. On LinkedIn. We spent a lot of time talking about LinkedIn. I’m telling y’all. This is going to be a huge way for black and brown creators. So get ready to catch that.
SPEAKER 2 59:53
Perfect. Thanks again, Julia.
SPEAKER 3 59:56
Thank you guys so much for having me. Appreciate it.